depressed! Every time I write IC and M/I , eventually, the Progressive Plot Story Point becomes the same. There is no difference between the two…Is there any skill to avoid?
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Well, first of all, don’t let such a simple thing affect you so poorly. Relax.
Secondly, I can’t give you a definitive opinion, but I think this is a natural part of the process. At least it’s a part of mine. Dramatica, when it’s laid out for you in squares and lines, makes everything look so neat and understandable–but, naturally, there is going to be some blending during the writing process. I think it’s ideal.
Don’t stress that you are or are not following Dramatica theory perfectly. If it’s getting you writing–especially if it’s your first time writing a story with Dramatica, then it’s working. Get the first draft done, then worry about separating the through-lines more or less according to the theory.
You got this.
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Also, fly2spring, you’ve realized one of the built-in aspects of the Dramatica theory: The Influence Character throughline and the Relationship throughline will always be in the same Theme Browser “plane” with each other, either vertically or horizontally.
If your IC throughline is in the upper left corner of the Theme Browser (Situation), then the MC/IC (Relationship) throughline will be in either the lower left corner (Manipulation) or the upper right corner (Activity). That is, the IC and Relationship throughlines will never be in dynamic-opposite positions from each other, but will always be either side-by-side or stacked on top of each other. Meaning that they should have quite a few similarities.
If they’re side-by-side in the upper quadrants, both will focus on the external world of Situations and Activities. If they’re side-by-side in the lower quadrants, both will focus on the internal world of Manipulations and Mindsets.
If they’re stacked on top of each other, then one will be in an active, cyclic flow (like either Manipulations or Activity), while the other will be in a static, more-rigid state (like Situation or Fixed Attititudes/Mindsets).
With either the software or a graphic of the Dramatica Theme Browser, go look through the story examples available at the Dramatica.com website under “Analysis”; you’ll soon start to see how the great stories bear out these alignments. Hope this helps a little, and like lovenote says: “Don’t stress… you got this”!
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Hi @fly2spring,
First off, try to throw the M/I term out of your vocabulary, and always refer to it as the Relationship Story Throughline, or RS for short. That will help you. (You’ll still have to translate when using the PC version, but it’s just translating.)
The other thing I can suggest is to describe the relationship story in a few words. “Father / son” or even “estranged father / son” works. Now think about the part of the story that would be different if the relationship was totally different – change “estranged father & son” to “budding romance” or “captor / captive”. That’s the part of the story that the RS focuses on, that connection between them that has its own life, its own perspective on conflict.
The Devil Wears Prada is a good film to watch where you can get a sense of that RS throughline being separate from the IC throughline. Maybe Collateral too – Tom Cruise’s character’s impact is huge but there is definitely a neat relationship that develops between the two of them, captor/captive to almost brothers.
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I was just having the same struggle! (I am still trying to work it out).
People had some really great advice: Distinguishing between IC and RS throughlines?
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I’ve had trouble with that as well. Particularly if the story is similar for both throughlines, like an IC who is stuck being a ghost and a Relationship that’s about haunting a house or something.
My suggestion is to try filling out a couple practice storyforms where the two throughlines are vastly different. For instance, an IC throughline of having an incurable disease with a Relationship about returning the treasure. Or maybe an IC who wants to win the race with a Relationship about being afraid of the dark. That way it’s easier to see the difference and get a feel for how to keep them separate.
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@lovenote @keypayton @mlucas @Lakis @Gregolas
Thank you very very much! I have learned a alot from your reply. My English is a novice, each one to reply to some difficulties. please understand.
Because of you, I found my confidence.
Love all of you!
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If there is no difference between them, I wonder if the IC could be a sidekick or guardian to the MC. Maybe, the impact is “speed things up” “oops, you’re going over a cliff” Look carefully, maybe a little difference is all you need. Western romances are mainly a Relationship Story (mc/ic) with the OS mostly background and a frame to show the relationship developing. Before publishers insisted on more graphic stuff in order to be published, there were quite a few well written stories out there showing the RS. You could talk to a librarian for suggestions. Now, mysteries, I’ve been told, are mainly OS with RS not as developed or important. What kind of book are you writing?
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@fly2spring, Here’s what goes on in my mind when I develop these two throughlines in a story…
I always keep in mind that I want two completely different stories that weave together somehow.
The MC/I is a story about how the Impact Character is trying to get the Main Character to change, whether she realized it or not.
I go so far as to pretend in my mind that I am writing a stand alone story about that relationship.
[a puppy who is always affectionate, and always “forgives” the little boy who is mean to it]
Then I try to create a completely different story about the impact character that may not even touch the Main Character directly, but whose actions will ultimately have a profound impact on the main character.
[wide-eyed puppy’s adventures as he discovers new exciting things in the world… and chews them to pieces.]
In the MC/I, there would be journeys and signposts as the little boy’s cruelty cause consequences like trips to the vet, spankings from parents, and etc., while the steadfast puppy comes back unconditionally loving the little boy, which erodes his cruel nature over time.
The IC story, even though filled with humor, excitement, and wonder, definitely has an impact on the little boy, even if he is not around since his toys are being chewed, and his rug is being soiled.
Anyway, I treat them like different stories, and as soon as the IC story begins to sound like another version of the MC/I, I change things.
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It took me a long time to realize it, but when I started writing with Dramatica, I had a tendency to come up with an Overall Story and then use the MC and IC players’ roles within that story (the roles of, say, Protagonist and Antagonist or some other archetype) for the MC and IC throughlines. For instance, if everyone was stuck in a problematic Situation, the MC might be doing something about that Situation while the IC had some problematic way of thinking about that Situation. So of course all four throughlines would feel like the exact same story. Once I was able to figure out what I was doing wrong and separate the four throughlines I feel like my grasp of the theory and how to apply it greatly improved, as did my storytelling. Wish I had figured that part out a lot sooner.
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Thanks!
At first thought it was easy to separate the four throughlines, but now find it difficult. 
I found this article, which seems to be a beginner’s common problem:)
“I’ve noticed two reccurent problems on Dramatica writers: 1) The “I’m encoding the same scene/information over and over in all the throughlines” syndrom. 2) The “I always fold a storyweaving” syndrom.”
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