Shouldn't most stories have a decision driver?

theory
#8

Thank you all for responding. This gave me a better understanding of action and decision drivers.

Still it is hard for me to decide how to apply it to my own story. (I know this is the ‘theory’ section; not ‘writing’ – sorry for that) I cannot look at how the story is framed, or at the consistency of the act turns, because maybe I didn’t do it right.

The causal relationship between x and y is sometimes hard to see, especially because people would make different decisions (or actions) although the same thing happens to them; yet they all might feel forced to that decision (except maybe the zen monk, which probably makes his story very boring). I can see that the action might force a decision, but since it can be any decision (dependent upon personalities etc), I doubt if there is any causality at all.

#9

Story Driver is definitely hard when it comes to your own story. I got it wrong for my story – I thought mine was Decision but it turned out (after Jim analyzed my synopsis as part of his narrative first services) I was wrong, it was Action!

In hindsight, I think it would have been very difficult for me to see that on my own. What might work for you is to try to create a short synopsis of your story (short enough for a friend to read, so maybe 1-2 pages?). Then show it to a friend or two, if they don’t know Dramatica that’s probably a good thing, and just ask them what they thought the real turning points are, the important events that change the direction or feeling of the story.

You could also post it here; if you don’t want it to be public you could make it a private message and invite forum users who are interested (private message threads can have multiple people).

Anyway that’s just my suggestion, maybe others would have better ideas.

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#10

Another way to look at it – a softer version of forcing – is to ask “could this have happened if X didn’t happen before?”

The fact that it could be any decision is fine. Are we all supposed to react to things the same way? __

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#11

I can agree that Jim’s analyzations are very helpful. I did his free From logline to treatment course and I was very pleased with what he and his team provided. I can only imagine how helpful his mentorship program would be. Unfortunately I can’t afford it; I am unemployed and I try to use the extra time I have to pursue a dream of mine: writing a novel.

It would be very helpful if some of you would want to take a look at my 1-page synopsis to see what the story driver would be. (And maybe also the OS/MC problem; that is the other choice I’m not sure about.) Please shoot me a personal message if you want to have a look at it, and don’t feel obligated to answer if you don’t know either.

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#12

As a hobbyist from v.1.6 days who also wants to be a professional writer, I suggest you practice writing the story from the beginning with the intention of starting with decision, then another with the intention of starting with action, and see how you interpret using those concepts. Coming at it from different angles can only help flush out the final product, so no loss. Some stories emphasize the OS, like with mysteries and some emphasize the RS, like with romances, then the other is only touched upon. Think: what do I want the MC problem to be, then write a lot about it. …on the run, here, so more thoughts later…

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#13

There is an alternative approach, similar to what @Prish is recommending. If you just write the story as you see it, you’ll be figuring out the storyform also. Instead of approaching it through the program, use your understanding of the story and let that be your guide. If you come across a scene where you don’t know what to do, then try a couple of things. Learn to sense what feels right. Experiment. You might surprise yourself.
__

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#14

Hi @TerryVog

Thanks so much for the plugs–but you should never feel like you can’t ask us questions about the synopsis you worked on in the course. While the mentorship and consulting is more for dedicated pursuit and study, we don’t mind answering one-off questions.

That said - I looked up your treatment/synopsis and your story is TOTALLY Action driven. Your storytelling focuses on the decisions your characters make but it’s always in response to an action that happened and caused them to make those decisions.

@MWollaeger’s litmus test: “could this have happened if X didn’t happen before” is the key to getting used to this.

A difficult thing for those new to Dramatica is to understand that it looks at your story not at your storytelling. The storytelling is everything you write, so the story–the part that Dramatica is looking at–is this kind of invisible thing that works in the background. You just have to build the skills to jump from looking at your story subjectively (when you write) and objectively (when you analyze, plan). You’ll get there, but it does take some time to get used to.

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#15

I was going to add this earlier, but somehow left it off. If your characters are having lots of decisions that almost seems like it has to be because there was an action that preceded it. The Driver has to be one thing, which rules out decision here as the driver.

[Clarification: the driver is one thing, but that one thing can be a compilation of several things: a city getting bombed and overrun by an invading army is a huge single event, even though it might take up quite a bit of time in the storytelling.]

You can’t have an effective driver if you have one person deciding “It’s time to quit my job” and someone else deciding “Let’s vote for Sally for class president.” Those things push the story in different directions.

#16

As an exercise, watch this trailer and see if you can figure out how the movie would begin and end with an Action Driver and with a Decision Driver. Throw in a Driver in the middle – doesn’t matter where – if you feel up to it.

I think it will give you a sense of what they are like, and having a bit of distance from your own story will help.

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Can anyone help me with the definitions for Action and Decision for Story Driver
#17

How could you put a driver in the middle?

#18

Stories have drivers all over the place. The most important ones are the ones that divide the acts, including the ones that start and end the story. I haven’t thought too too hard about it, but I’d venture that every story must have five drivers:

• Begin the story
• Transition from Act 1 to Act 2
• Transition from Act 2 to Act 3
• Transition from Act 3 to Act 4
• End of movie

But this doesn’t preclude having drivers, even multiple drivers, in the middle of an Act.

• Luke discovers the Princess is on board the Death Star and decides to go get her.
• Darth Vader realizes that Obi Wan is aboard the Death Star and decides to confront him one on one. • Obi Wan realizes Luke needs him more dead than alive, and decides to let Darth Vader kill him.

Mike

#19

So, is his realizing an action or is this a decision driver? I took it, at first, as a decision driver, then I wondered if observing and realizing could be an action, or is it just part of the decision process?

#20

I think in this case it’s an action because it is a thought that strikes him as he sees Luke. There’s no deliberation.

#21

I think you could probably use the word ‘discover’ instead of ‘realize’ in all three of your examples, and it will still be accurate, and more obvious that they are Action drivers. Even for the last one it would work.

Although is it possible an even stronger Action driver existed, like the duel itself? showing that Obi-Wan is outmatched?

#22

Sure, and this goes to the idea that “Actions” don’t have to be single events, but can be a string of related events.

Seriously, though, you think he was outmatched?

#23

Hmm… I think my judgement on the matter is forever clouded by being 4 years old in a dark theater, clutching to my dad because I was terribly afraid of the man/machine in the black suit…

#24

haha, good point. I don’t remember how I felt then. But now I see Vader as a bit desperate when he stoops to calling Obi Wan a weak old man.

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#25

From an arrogant bully to a desperate old man…funny.

#26

Aren’t most arrogant bullies desperately weak inside?

#27

From a kid’s eye view to a teen’s, and now to a man’s. You should enter one of those story-in-a-sentence contests.