Dramatica & Interactive Fiction, Can it be done?

I’ve looked at the link you’ve provided @SPotter. I don’t know much about D&D, but I know it exists as a game to play amongsts friends, face to face, as well as in digital online versions. I must admit that I’ve never quite came to grips with massive multiplayer immersion worlds. I’ve taken interested, as of lately, in MUDs and MOOs, and experimented with Evennia (a FOSS Python framework for creating MUDs and MOOs), but maybe due to my Interactive Fiction experience I have a bias toward understanding the mechanics of multiplayer persistent worlds—and I’ve failed badly to understand how they are to be designed.

From D&D, I’ve started thinking therefore of multiplayer virtual worlds, and I remembered a passage from Richard A. Bartle’s Designing Virtual Worlds (considered by many as «the Bible» of multiplayer virtual world games), so I went and fetched it:

Players consume content quicker than it can be produced. To prevent a virtual world from becoming “played out,” therefore, some mechanism for reintroducing content must be installed——the reset strategy of the virtual world. There are two basic approaches: sudden and rolling.
This is not necessarily true of the virtual worlds of the future, in which content may arise from player actions rather than being introduced by designers, but it’s true for virtual worlds of the present.
[Designing Virtual Worlds, “Reset Strategy”]

He then goes on to describe different approaches to how a virtual world can be driven toward is final stages and then “resurrected”. I think this does tie in to the Grand Argument Story—after all, if we take the virtual world and its game experience as a narrative that unfolds through time (no matter which roles are served by the players), at the end of its narrative cycle, all players should be able to look back and appreciate the storypoints and dramatics they’ve experienced. So, a virtual world could have a set of rules by which to determine if the players are triggering the right dramatic points that would then shift the narrative to a next stage—and the virtual world would then take care of updating all its players population of the changes taking places. New stage, new pressures, new immediate apparent problems, and so on.

Any virtual world could emphasize things like forewarning, dividends, costs, ecc., in a manner of ways (NPCs gossiping in taverns, TVs, radios, newspapers, ecc.)

(note: the author speaks mainly of digital worlds, but not only! he points out over and over the link between table top games and video games of this genre).

As mentioned, I fail to grasp the multiplayer medium (especially NPCs, or “mobiles” as they are often called in teh genre), but I guess that there are backend tricks to ensure each player is granted basic appreaciations—even if by “enforcing” them on him, specifically.

In text-adventures IF the problem should be easier because they are single player, turn based, and take no account of real-time. A single player can easily be handled, and appreciations can be enforced on him—“cut scenes” in which the player is suspended from his role of controlling his subjective character, and presented with an objective outside view of the story, either out of character or from another character’s POV.

At the end, when we watch a movie or read a book, we as spectators/readers are able to jump in and out of the MC, the subjective and the objective view, and still appreciate his throughline even though we are participant to Overall Story events which are not part of the MC knowledge. The fact that the player might be controlling the MC actions as is in-game character doesn’t compromise this knowledge: in IF games is not enough to know something as a player, your character can’t carry out actions unless he has the prerequisite knowledge—so, for example, when you replay an adventure, and you already know the name of a given NPC, you might still not interact with him until your character discovers (ie: “earns” through interactions) the name/identity of that NPC.

Often IF puzzles are about discovering how to get to a specific situation, even if you already know the solution—you must still gather the means. And I think this could be a general consideration for any single player video game.

The IF game designer knows that he has to constrain player choices to make them consistent with the world he is building, and ultimately you deliver an illusion of choices, not a truly openworld in which all choices will be accepted—more like the conjurer’s freedom of choice when he asks you to “chose” a card. Some of these choices would be specifically tied to a different story-path, ultimately moving the player/character through different storyforms, at specific nodal points of the story.

Labeling some actions as “good”, “evil”, or other relevant qualifications, could allow the designer to measure and qualify the overall tendency of the player during a whole stage of play, and ultimately decide which storyform to employ for (e.g.) the second part of the game. This approach would avoid a binary situation in which the player has to chose at once his course of story, and in my opinion it would allow a subtler, more spread-in-time measurement of the player mental approach to the game.

I guess that different video game genres would have to approach it from different angles, so I can only really speak for IF since I have some experience in it. But the more I think about it the more I am convinced that, as long as the finished game presents the player with a complete Grand Arg.Story, interactivity can be introduced in different ways, at different levels, and the designer would only have to ensure that all possible narrative paths are consistent in themselves. Possibly, some Dramatica appreciations might be presented to the player in non-orthodox ways (ie: non-linear in time, or order), but counterbalancing tricks can be employed to make sure the player is reminded of their importance (or existence) at key points of the adventure—NPCs dialogues, a radio broadcast, a newspaper or TV in a room, ecc.

Inform7 is a good tool for experiment all these, because it allows to create such criteria in an almost natural language. So part of the code would (more or less, but quite closely) look like:

Hitting an unarmed person is an evil action.
Saving somebody and feeding somebody are good actions.
When Act 2 begins:
    If the number of player's good actions is greater than the number of player's evil actions:
[...]

which of course looks much more familiar to us than some computerish-syntaxed language, and somehow makes it simpler to build decision rules which reflect our intentions and mental description of a problem—but then again, Inform7 is one of those things you either love it or ate it, and not all IF designer went for it, some stuck to older Object-Oriented Language designing tools.

Also, Inform7 has the Skein tool/functionality, which allows to keep track of all possible different player paths in the game—both graphically and textually—thus making it easier to test and debug all story paths and ramifications.

Anyhow, speaking from my experience I think that Inform7 as a tool, and text-adventures as a game genre, are a good medium for ground-testing Dramatica in non-linear interactive fiction: (1) Inform7 source code almost looks like English, so most people can make sense of it and follow the game mechanics; (2) text-adventures can be a good compromise between storytelling and gaming, without actually leaving the field of writing.

Then, whatever lessons are to be learned from such experiments, they can easily be transposed to other video game genres.

Tristano

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I have a hard time understanding how gamers could play as anyone other than the MC. The very act of puppeteering / manuevering a character makes it the personal, subjective view.

The only possibility I can think of is in the first-person POV genres, where it’s possible to never display the avatar. The player could act as a cameraman and spend time documenting the MC’s adventures.

Basically, if you’re not the MC, then who you’re operating must have zero dramatic impact on the story, IMO.

Assuming that the player controls some sort of character in an environment (that doesn’t have to be the case after all) then, yeah, it would make sense if that character is the Main Character. When I suggested removing the MC Throughline I didn’t mean that we shouldn’t play the MC, but rather that, Dramatica-wise, their throughline isn’t developed (or not as developed as the other throughlines).

I’m not sure if talking about Multiplayer experiences like D&D helps at this stage at all.

In the project I described, you would actually have a developed MC throughline. As mentioned, the psychologist character and patient character are separated so that we have an in-universe excuse why you can’t just solve the problem from the beginning, and why we can choose between different stories (story forms). It seems as though the major difference between my idea and @SPotter’s is the framing.

I listened to the Susan O’Connor podcast and there wasn’t really anything I haven’t heard before aside from the protagonist issue @SPotter mentions. I don’t necessarily agree with what she’s saying though? I mean, yeah, we wouldn’t feel for Walter White’s family like he would, if you start the game and “BAM! there’s your family! love them!” If we start without a family and learn to love the characters throughout the first part of the game, then maybe we could get something similar to Breaking Bad.

She also speaks of the gamer’s mindset of “I don’t care what I’m doing as long as I’m winning” which is something that you probably shouldn’t support if writing an interactive story is your goal instead of “just” making a fun game (Relevant article by frictional games, in their game Amnesia, they actually tell the player at the beginning that it’s not about beating the game). There are people playing “Papers, Please” without considering ethical issues; they simply look at how to best beat the game. But I would guess that most people do look at what they’re doing to these fictional people. And, I don’t think using something as taxing as Dramatica makes a whole lot of sense if all you’re trying to do is put some decoration to hang of your gameplay.

I was thinking about what would happen if you left certain essential questions unanswered at the beginning, like the Judgment as @SPotter suggested. With Judgment, we leave things like Unique Abilities, Critical Flaws, Inhibitors, Catalysts and the Plot Progression open (at least with Linear Main Characters; for whatever reason, the Holistic ones have further reach). And I wonder if one could show these story points more or less ambiguously for a while until setting them at the end. For example, for the first three acts, the MC’s unique ability seems to be Senses but it could also be Conditioning; their Critical Flaw is either State of Being or Circumstances. During the fourth act, and after the player made certain choices beforehand, we determine that the MC’s unique ability was actually a case of Senses, while their critical flaw has something to do with their Circumstances, ending the story with a Good judgment.

Although if the point of the game is to make a point, then maybe it would be better to have two Resolve/Judgment combinations. E.g. remain steadfast and it ends badly, change and it ends well. Or something like that.

@Tristano , when I was making my project, I used the Star Wars storyform to make the first storymind, simply because I found that one to be the easiest to grasp and the world is kind of video-gamey to begin with. I think that if someone were to take the storyform of “Pride and Prejudice” and turned it into Interactive Fiction, it wouldn’t be all too different from current Visual Novels and/or Dating Sims.


@jhull I wasn’t really trying to make your post look insincere. I was just observing how sarcasm has apparently become my default when it comes to reading people’s positive declarations.

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I must definitely ask Melanie permission to reproduce here part of her email reply to my question (I wouldn’t feel at ease just pasting it here without asking first). I can’t for obvious reason restate her long mail without incurring in the risk of distorting part of her considerations (her reply is lengthy, and words are selectively picked).

But, yes: Melanie did provide an argument for placing the player in a non-MC position, and she suggested as an example the position of a narrator (further distinguishing between passive and active narrators), his role being that of determining by himself the order of exploration of the story-world components. Her explanation took in consideration the fact that after the unraveling of the whole story, the audience is left with an understanding which is beyond the mere order of exploration—in fact, I add, for stories where temporal order is non linear (eg: movies like Memento, or the European edition of Once Upon A Time in America) we are able to mentally reconstruct the whole story (including its missing parts, or anyhow to fill the holes, like it happens with propaganda techniques).

If player was narrator, the MC could be a character we meet in the game world, relating to us about his throughline ongoings and progress, but at the same time free to carry on along his due journey—I gather that he would become like a yardstick to us, allowing us to measure story progress by how he is doing and what he tells us. Surely, it will have to be a very interactive NPC. Still, we could aid him, pave his path for him, or hinder him, and then measure the results of those actions on the overall storyline (as well as the MC’s line as well)—which game-wise would qualify us as Sidekick or Contagonist, or some other objective archetype role. Still, at the end the story would have unfolder its due course, and we would appreaciate its Gr.Argument.

I guess there could also be a God-Like modality of playing, where we soon come to realizing that our actions affect the gameworld in deep manners.

Anyhow, Melanie also confirmed that player as MC would require a linear experience of impact by events and Obstacle Character, and so on.

True, being in a character give the player a subjective view of the game. But then again, cut scenes can be presented out-of-character, and the player can be moved temporarily to other game characters—I can also think of many console games where you play different characters in different chapters, and this is often done to allow the player to gain overall knowledge not accessible through a single character. What was a character’s subjective view before, will no longer look thus when you’re in his opponent shoes. Also, I’m thinking of the theory book metaphor of the General, the soldier, and so on. As long as you are playing an objective character without having to worry about his resolve, personal problem, ecc., then you are interacting objectively with the story.

Now, as for passionate and dispassionate argument … well, I guess that even if you are moved to another character you’ll be still passionate about the previous character you’ve driven so far. It dipends how its presented, and what role the new PC has to the MC. If the game was Star Wars, and all of a sudden you were thrown into one of the robots, in the middle of 2n Act, probably you’d still be thinking of Luke’s faith, and act to help him from your new perspective. Does it make sense? Or am I missing a point here?

Melanie also mentioned the possibility of getting rid of MC altogether, along the lines of propaganda-techniques mentioned in this thread.

Her mail then goes quite deep into the subject, bringing up the issues of “open-system IF worlds” (“no fixed narrative, just a fixed subject matter story world”), which could have either an “open-ended” narrative (“never-ending”) or one that is “closed but constantly reorganizing itself into a different form”. But here my ability to report without distorting fails, because she enters the subject of fractal psychology, and how Mental Relativity allows to add higher (or lower) levels of abstraction to accomodate similar situations.

But it’s clear to me from her email that the subject of Dramatica’s potential use for non-linear videogames has been touched upon before, and it’s possibile. I’ll write her to ask permission to paste here her email, which I’m sure would provide a good twist to the thread.

@bobRaskoph:

I was thinking about what would happen if you left certain essential questions unanswered at the beginning, like the Judgment as @SPotter suggested. With Judgment, we leave things like Unique Abilities, Critical Flaws, Inhibitors, Catalysts and the Plot Progression open (at least with Linear Main Characters; for whatever reason, the Holistic ones have further reach). And I wonder if one could show these story points more or less ambiguously for a while until setting them at the end. For example, for the first three acts, the MC’s unique ability seems to be Senses but it could also be Conditioning; their Critical Flaw is either State of Being or Circumstances. During the fourth act, and after the player made certain choices beforehand, we determine that the MC’s unique ability was actually a case of Senses, while their critical flaw has something to do with their Circumstances, ending the story with a Good judgment.

Although if the point of the game is to make a point, then maybe it would be better to have two Resolve/Judgment combinations. E.g. remain steadfast and it ends badly, change and it ends well. Or something like that.

These are fine points, and useful observations. I didn’t realize that linear/holistic difference left such a long “corridor” open in the way of storypoints.

And yes, I’m planning to approach the issue like you advice: choose a well formed story already existing (in my case, not just the storyform, but the whole story), and which offers good gaming potential (if not in terms of plot, at least in terms of world-exploration) and then make some sort of re-adaption work in IF. Hopefully, I was thinking of some P.K.Dick novel, which usually provide nice worlds for interactivity. I am not sure though if his novels do qualify for Grand Argument Stories—usually they are rather short, and even though Blade Runner the movie (but also Paycheck and other adaptations) does provide a Gr.Ar.St., the short novel it was adapted from might not. I know I could just fill in the holes, but my whole point is that I want to have the chance that players might compare the original novel experience to the gaming one, and see if playing it provides the same dramatic impact or not.

Surely, Sci-Fi is a good genre for IF, even if plot is brought forth by the game mechanics, the environment offers ample possibilities for significant puzzle-solvings that might relate to storypoints.

Best regards,

Tristano

      • MELANIE A. PHILIPS ON DRAMATICA FOR IF * * *

Melanie replied to my email request and granted me permission to paste in this thread her email on the subject. So here is the email body text (dated, 30 Oct 2015):

Here’s the gist of using Dramatica for IF (we have made a number of presentations on this to various companies over the years, but never resulting in a contract for consulting, as of yet).

At the most basic level, consider how a story appears to an audience after it is completed. It ceases to be a linear experience and becomes a networked experience in which all dramatic elements of the storyform are appreciated at once, rather than revealed over time. Further, when you separate the storytelling sequence of linearity from the story structural temporal progressions of growth, for example, you can appreciate that growth in all its stages at once, after the story has been experienced.

Once an audience leaves a story, though they may replay certain sequences in their minds, they tend to consider the story as a whole - a world in which things happened rather than a pathway that was followed.

Consider, then, the first-person player perspective in a game is not necessarily to provide experiences in a sequence that will bring the MC to the point of potential change, but rather to explore all corners of the Story World until the nature of how all the elements and dynamics at work in that particular storyform are identified and understood.

Also consider just because the player is in first person in the game does not require that the player be the main character. In many stories there is a narrator. Narrators can be passive or active. The player, by choosing in what order to explore the world is much better put in the position of narrator, the interlocutor who determines for himself or herself the order in which the components of the story world are to be explored - much as one might make multiple trips to a buffet table or select items in dim sum and choose the order in which to consume them.

Sure, if one insisted the player were the MC, then you would be locked into a linear experience of being impacted by events and by the Influence Character in a particular order. But an IF in which the player is actually the narrator, then the MC appears from time to time in the story world, having experienced things in the proper order for him to make a choice, but likely in a different order than the player. For example, the MC in the story world shows up and the player says - “Let’s work together and head up to the badlands.” The MC replies, “Already been there, just before the big explosion. Change me in ways I’d rather not talk about, but it made me realize there may be another way of looking at the morality of this whole conflict.” And then he disappears back into the battle.

In this manner, the MC is separated from the Player and can go about his journey of discovery in the proper order.

So, while eliminating the MC may be a technique (as described in some of the propaganda entries in your message thread), I feel that for IF you simply don’t want your player as the MC but definitely want him in the game with the player as self determining narrator.

But, your questions go beyond this in two specific areas: One, how does one handle multiple narratives (storyforms) within the same narrative space and, Two, what about open-system IF worlds in which there is no fixed narrative, just a fixed subject matter story world in which the narrative is either open-ended (never-ending) or is closed but constantly reorganizing itself into a different form.

As for the first question, narratives are fractal by nature (see my articles and videos on narrative psychology). Even within a single narrative there are two fractal dimensions - that of the group mind and that of the individuals within the group mind. As you know, story structure came to be because storytellers were trying to document what goes on in our heads and hearts and also how we relate to one another. Each of us has certain built-in attributes such as Reason and Skepticism (as seen in the Reason and Skeptic archetypes). We use the full complement of these to solve our individual problems. But when we come together in a group to solve or explore an issue of common interest or concern, we immediately begin to specialize so that the individual best at reasoning becomes the Voice of Reason for the group. The most skeptical becomes the group’s resident Skeptic. In this manner, all the fundamental attributes of any individual mind are replicated and represented by individuals in the group mind. In this manner, group issues are explored from all essential sides and in greater depth by the specialists than could be achieved by a group of general practitioners who are all trying to do all the jobs at the same time.

This tendency to form group minds made up of specialists is what was observed by storytellers and documented in the conventions of story structure and is also what forms the basis for the fabric and framework of social interactions.

So, the first fractal dimension is the mind of the individual that is then replicated in the second fractal dimension of the group mind. But, one is not solely a member of a single group. We have one narrative role in our business, another perhaps as a parent, or in our political party, a proud resident of a state, of the nation, or even just as a fan of a particular television program or of a rock star.

Within the narrative space of our lives, we may belong to more than one group mind and these group minds may occupy completely different areas of the narrative space, may move through the narrative space gradually shifting the subject matter with which they deal, may share a sub set of content that is affected by both, may move through each other like galaxies colliding, may pass each other close enough to alter the storyform of each almost gravitationally (dynamically) even though they never actually share the same space, and some narratives may be satellites of other narratives or may be connected in additional levels of fractal association.

On that last point, for example, one may may be a member of a clique that is part of a club that is part of a movement that is part of political organization within a state that is in a collective effort within a country. Like nested dolls, all of what is at the top is determined by all that is at the lower fractal levels, but the top also defines the largest parameters of the group identity and therefore the personal identity of all individual members at the bottom of the fractal hierarchy, while each lower dimension contributes more refined subordinate traits to the lowest level individuals, defining them but also identifying them as different in some ways than other branches within the same general organization.

And so, people become groups and act as archetypes within them, then several groups band together within a larger group mind in which the smaller groups act as archetypes and so on, in a fractal manner, until the group reaches the maximum membership and number of levels it can sustain before collapsing from beneath due to the intrinsic differences of the lowest level members in which personal needs may outweigh allegiance and conformity to group ideals.

As for your second inferred question, storyforms can alter in an unlimited manner due to forces external to the storyform but in the same narrative space. And so, if you begin with a structure and that defines the nature and extent of the narrative, it provides an initial psychological matrix in which the player of an IF might come to be drawn into a game. But even after exploring a small portion of the initial storyform, you can provide choices to your player that would alter the storyform to create a new complete narrative that invalidates the old one. In the real world, we are always tearing down narratives and replacing them with new ones that better fit changing situations in a chaotic world. We may hold onto certain structural relationships in all of our narratives because we have found by experience that there are truisms worth maintaining. But much of what we hold as the principal driving stories of different aspects of our lives (and with different group minds) can be altered by brute force from the outside by a hostile take over, a powerful sub-group that rises to a position of leverage, or even by a change in circumstances such as an earthquake that destroys the power grid.

By nature, we try to maintain as much of the previous narrative as we can, for that is our experience base, but new rules come into play. And so, we accept the new that cannot be changed, then using that as a seed, go on to build a new narrative beginning with the elements from the old that are still possible within the new reality and that are most important to us. We add in as many of our most important narrative pieces as we can within the constraints of the new elements that have been imposed, and then make the best possible remaining new choices to create a new narrative. For without a narrative, we have no framework by which to evaluate our lives and ourselves or even to measure if things are getting better or worse.

So in conclusion (for now) consider that narratives are constantly creating new fractal dimensions at both the top when they form a new larger group mind and at the bottom when an individual department has grown so large it must cease to be an individual and become a group mind by sub-dividing into smaller departments. In addition, they are constantly affect by other narratives in the same narrative space, even to the point of having some of their elements and relationships altered so that the narrative must reform in a new form. And so, the ongoing expansion and contraction of fractals and cascading reformation through forces outside the limits of the closed system of individual narratives creates a vibrant and energetic dynamic environment in which IF can flourish.

Thanks for asking some interesting questions and pointing to an interesting message thread.

Melanie
Storymind

As you can see, the reply digs into the question from different angles, and offers a good context view of how Dramatica might be applied to IF games—no way I could resume it without messing up its detailed explanation.

I really hope this might become a good reference point on the subject.

Tristano

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Here is the same text posted on Melanie’s site under the title, “Using Dramatica for Interactive Fiction”: http://storymind.com/page545.htm

Wow, a TON of info! I’ll try to read it over the weekend.