Complex themes in stories?

I am a bit puzzled about how to work with complex themes in the practice. I understand the theory (Issue vs. Counterpoint in terms of the co-dynamic pair), but I’m not sure how it works on the level of scene, sequence etc.
The book mentions the “Gone with the Wind” as a themathically extremly rich story, and that "with Gone With the Wind, enjoying the story comes largely from what happens between the lines. ", but it doesn’t give any other example.
Do you know other stories with complex themes? How do you know if a story themathically complex?

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I associate “complex themes” with:

  1. The “arguments” are not one-sided. No strawmen.
  2. The “arguments” are subtextual not textual.
    (3). Plot/caper mechanics & spectacle are often de-emphasized. This is not essential.

Examples: Whiplash, Little Miss Sunshine, Lone Star, Florida Project, Shawshank Redemption, In Bruges, The Lives of Others.

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In addition to what @HaroldLloyd said, Jim has a really excellent article in which he talks about connecting theme and plot.

I suspect the simple (but hopefully not simplistic) answer is that as long as you’re working with a complete story, what you’re writing will be inherently rich thematically, because you’re exploring an inequity from multiple perspectives by design.

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I rewatched the first two seasons of Games of Thrones, and I am wondering if the earlier seasons of the show were more nuanced themathically, than the more action-packed newer ones. (examples: Season 7-8?)
(I don’t know the Storyform, but it seemed to me that there was a more definite argument in the level of Self-Interest vs Morality / Approach vs Attitude. Example: Ned Stark is a honorable man and try to save others, and this approach leads to his death etc. It’s themathically more complex than an average fantasy story)

I respectfully disagree. Ned Stark was the epitome of one of my favorite adages: Without stupidity there is no plot. He didn’t get into trouble because he was honorable, he got into trouble because he was dumb.

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It’s okay, I agree with this. I didn’t mean that his decision was smart, or wise. He puts his values before logic. But his case is an argument against a particular morality-based approach in the world of GOT.
I came up with this example, because I saw many fantasy stories where Morality is almost always good, and Self-Interest is almost always bad. In many cases, the “honor before reason” character turns out to be the Hero of the story, because the author thinks it’s the right thing to do and because… Deus Ex Machina. :wink:
I think, GOT is an interesting example in terms of Theme, because it’s not about black-and-white morality. Sometimes Morality leads to a good outcome (example: Jon’s friendship with Sam), sometimes it’s leads to a bad outcome (Examples: in the case of Eddard, or when Daenerys saves Mirri Maz Duur, who later betrays her). Also Self-Interest could be both good (Example: Tyrion’s self-preservation) and bad (Examples: Sansa’s selfishness, Joffrey’s sadistic tendencies etc).

(English is not my mother tongue. So I just hope, I didn’t make too many grammatical errors… :blush: )

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Has anyone tried to come up with a storyform for GoT season 1? I think there might be a complete story there with Ned as MC and Caitlyn as IC.

It would make sense that the OS Concern would be Obtaining, but I could also see Learning – there are lot of problematic discoveries/attempted discoveries in the story.

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