My advice as a potential reader/viewer to anyone creating Dramatica related content would be to do your best to upload said content mainly between November or so and late Feb/early March. Jim has a whole built-in audience that I bet starts jonesin for some Dramatica content right around those months.
Don’t get me wrong though, I’m also perfectly willing to browse multiple Dramatica sites a day.
I don’t have much to add to this conversation other than to say awesome idea @Audz. And I agree with everyone that #2 would seem to address a real need. Addressing @mlucas questions about process would be particularly welcome – Armando’s book is great for example, but all of his examples are very neat and idealized where as reality (at least when you’re still learning?) feels much messier. Acknowledgment of that and how to deal with it could be very useful. On that front, if you were interested, interspersing interviews with other experts could be cool as well.
Regarding option 1 – I think that’s actually a great idea too. I know nothing about Middlemarch other than it’s a great novel and it’s really long so it probably has multiple storyforms. There’s actually very little Dramatica analysis at that scale – for obvious reasons – but I think there’s a need for it, given the move toward series/serials across media and genres.
For a title, think backward from google search terms that people would use. I send much encouragement and pledge to listen/read!
Writing with Dramatica
Practical Dramatica
Getting Started with Dramatica
How to Use Dramatica
Dramatica for Beginners
It would be great to have a troubleshooting segment too, where perhaps you interview an expert on how to handle such and such. I’m at a loss for examples, but I’m always running into trouble.
I’d also love to see real examples of how people use Dramatica to create shorter works: short stories, essays, etc.
How about Dramatica to create 4 panel comic strips?
Dramatica in the real world? Dramatica as a means of self-examination, exploring one’s personal issues (or hypothetically personal issues)?
I wondered about Dramatica as a means to compose subject matter for Art. Paintings, Murals, etc.
So much to play with here.
How about titling it: A User’s Guide to Dramatica? It keeps it humble, from a users perspective, rather than an experts. However, having expert interviews would be fabuloso!
I think @HaroldLloyd’s suggestion of using a title that is search optimized will get you the most mileage.
@HaroldLloyd, seems like Practical Dramatica might’ve crossed my mind as a potential blog name a time or two. Might be on to something there.
“Dramatica in Practice”?
The thing is though, I dunno if the name “dramatica” is proprietary. I mean, I’m guessing Chris and Melanie would be fine with it, but I’m a worrywart, you see.
maybe we can call on @jhull and/or @chuntley to discuss any limitations on or suggestions about user-created material?
I like the name “Dramatica in Practice”. Short, to the point, and practical.
Dramatica is a registered trademark of Write Brothers, so you have to be careful using without getting some sort of sign off from us/them. Certified Dramatica Consultants, like Jim and Sandy Stone, have some flexibility with using the trademark, since they’ve gone through the process of proving a working knowledge of the Dramatica theory and usage.
At a minimum, if you want to use Dramatica® formally, we request proper attribution and notices.
That said, don’t let that stop you from moving forward with your blog/podcast/video series.
Cheers,
Chris
@Audz I’m an aspiring novelist who has been struggling to implement the dramatica theory into my own work so option 2 would be awesome.
You certainly seem to know what you’re talking about. And there really hasn’t been much of anything dealing with novels. And not enough people talking about implementing dramatica into a piece of work from start to finish.
I’m excited to see where you take things.
How dare you even consider moving in on my territory!
(Not really).
A new voice discussing their experiences with Dramatica would be incredible. One of my intentions behind building this forum was to lessen the resistance encountered when learning and discussing the theory. Individual blogs and podcasts are another way to achieve this same goal and, from my own experience, a fantastic way for the publisher to increase his or her knowledge of the theory.
It’s a tremendous amount of work–the seasonal approach (Mar-Nov) is one way I can guarantee the quality of the episodes (and the articles), and a method I would highly suggest (however your seasonal inclinations turn out). Plus, it gives me time to wrap things up and work on other projects (like the Atomizer).
I always find the work of others inspires me–so if there’s more work in this space, that means further development of my work and the theory in general, and then that means things keep going up and up…
…in other words, yes, please!
In regards to Story Structure Senioritis and a more practical approach to Dramatica, for some reason, I always feel inspired to write more about how to use Dramatica in the creation of narrative towards the end of November. I did it last year, my articles always trend towards that area as the clouds roll in, and then I hibernate and write, and then once I see my shadow in Feb, come back out and start the whole thing again.
I recorded the second part of that episode this week (and the season finale) which ended up being twice as long as any episode–but I’m sure you’ll appreciate the discussion around how to build a story (instead of tearing one down). It’s all based on my work with novelists and screenwriters (though most of my work is with novelists) and my experience with the Deliberate Storytelling service I offer on my site.
I actually ended up really liking the story I made up on the spot and–if I can manage the time–will end up writing it. The only thing is–once you get into the actual writing of the piece, it shifts from theory to the talent of the individual (from Knowledge to Ability…and eventually slides into Desire), and from there the process becomes very subjective. An individual artist could take my outline and come up with an entirely different story. It’s difficult to quantify the talent and perseverance that happens at this point–which is why I don’t spend a lot of time on it.
Every artist is unique and maintains their special approach to the material. The people I work with are insanely talented–and uniquely original–all I can do is help them understand how Situation and Circumstances work within the context of Doing and then it’s up to them to actually make it land on the page.
That said, I can relate to this:
It bugs me that so many writers are missing out on the kind of depth Dramatica theory can provide to their stories
As that pretty much sums up my motivation behind Narrative First.
Personally, I can’t stand listening to other podcasts on writing or screenwriting as they delve too much into opinion and storytelling. A new voice focusing on Dramatica and insights into different approaches to applying the theory?
I’ll be the first to subscribe.
…and so much, too much, way too much about the “Hero’s Journey”. Sometimes I feel like screaming, “Yes. It’s a story structure. But it’s not the ONLY story structure. How about the 30,000 some odd other ones to choose from?”
Thanks, Jim, for all you do. Love the podcasts and your articles.
I love the idea of both - I am really starved of Dramatica analysis of novels, and books are books - we don’t want them all being like films. I think To Kill a Mockingbird is the only one I can remember, and that is a very short book. Middlemarch interests me because it is quite complex, possibly more throughlines, whereas a YA novel is more likely to have a simpler plot.
There is also Lord of the Flies.
It’s also not that long a book, but they all reduce to the same sized Storyform regardless. I would be curious to see what a long, complex novel would yield in terms of new insights.
Just out of curiosity, what are the other ones that have caught your attention? (I’m assuming you don’t mean anything film related, like Truby or Snyder.)
@MWollaeger: I was actually referring to the 32768 storyforms that Dramatica offers. I just find all the Hero’s Journey talk to be so limiting and formulaic. But I have come across others, some standard, some obscure, all varied story narrative theories/books that many tout: Hero’s Journey, Save The Cat, various Beat Sheets, Lester Dent’s Pulp Paper Master Fiction Plot, Snowflake, Story Grid, Plotto, Book Architecture/Blueprint Your Bestseller; Brook’s Story Engineering, Truby’s Anatomy of Story, Gotham Writer’s Workshop, Romancing the Beat, Writing the Blockbuster Novel, and Million Dollar Outlines, to name more than a few. Whew.
I love that within Dramatica itself, there are so many possibilities available and ways to go that the others only point to individually. 2 Act. 3 Act. 4 or more Act. 4 separate throughlines with which you can make a tale or grand argument story, go wide, go deep, whatever.
I think John Le Carre’s A Perfect Spy would be an interesting one. Three possible contenders for IC and I would like to see how the converging stories of lifetime (MC) and recent past (OS) would play themselves out in the throughlines. Each time I read this book I am more impressed by it.
I must check out Lord of the Flies - thanks for the tip-off!
I would definitely subscribe! I’ve been hoping for Dramatica resources and examples for novelists since getting involved in 2002.
Of the Dramatica examples that ship with the software, the following analyses are based on books:
Lolita
Lord of the Flies
Sula
The Sun Also Rises
To Kill A Mockingbird
Washington Square
Great one @Audz. I’ll be subscribing. Working on an epic fantasy novel so I’ll be looking out for tips. So option #2 is what I’d pick. Someday I hope to share a few of my own as well. Bless u!
Not to mention “Charlotte’s Web.”
@Audz, I absolutely love the idea of #2. I’ll subscribe too! 