Snowpiercer, currently in theaters

Could Namgoong be the Protagonist? He literally moves the story forward, car by car, and brings the story to an explosive end. It’s true he’s not in the very beginning of the movie, but he’s also the revolution’s first step towards their goal, so there’s no doubt he’s represented. Of course, there’s no reason the story has to follow archetypes at all, but I see Namgoong at least taking part of the Protagonist’s duties.

Incidentally, I really liked the unintentional meta-pun of Captain America becoming a shield at the end. :wink:

Namgoong wouldn’t go on his own, which makes it tough to consider him as a pursuit character.

Well, unless he’s in pursuit of enough of that industrial waste to make his bomb. I’m thinking these characters do not fit neatly into archetypes. Curtis certainly has aspects of the Protagonist, but Namgoong brings the story to its conclusion.

He certainly accrues plenty of it, but he make it clear enough (to me) that he is waiting for something before he acts – either getting more waste or seeing more of the plane, or something. He’s also in a stupor when they find him, which (while not making it impossible) seems to counter-indicate “the desire to seek.”

Archetypes are collections of traits, and I would say that they are generally rare. Protagonist tends to be loosely used to indicate the character who has the pursuit trait.

If you follow Kurt Vonnegut’s rule (“Everybody has to want something, even if it’s a glass of water”) you run into the problem of seeing everyone as having pursuit. But just because someone wants something and they go for it doesn’t make it pursuit. Woody Harrelson’s character in Zombieland wanted and went for Twinkies whenever he could – but that was Temptation and not pursuit.

Where does it say that the Protagonist has to bring the story to its conclusion? (Read Lord of the Flies for a story where this doesn’t happen.)
What story does Namgoong bring to a conclusion? How is that ending different from Curtis putting his arm into the engine? Are you seeing his work as the end because it happens closer to the end of the movie?

Look, I was no fan of the end of this movie. I found it brutally nihilistic, and I was frustrated that – after investing so much time in Curtis – we followed someone else’s plan. (See @JBarker’s comment above.) This doesn’t mean Curtis wasn’t the protagonist. It just means the movie was uncomfortable.

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That’s a interesting take on it but I saw it being a bit more Christian in a way. If you consider some of the MC moments for example Curtis ate a baby at one point, felt terrible about it, but was redeemed or perhaps born again after seeing the sacrifices made by Gilliam he then ultimately, at the end, sacrifices himself so that humanity will have a chance.

The imagery at the end seems very Adam and Eve-ish as well with the two “train babies” who will presumably go out into the world and create a new civilization.

And the part about following Curtis’ plan and rooting for him but ultimately taking someone else’s plan is sort of true I suppose but again, if you consider that his goal was all along tainted (the train was being powered by child labor) he had no choice but to destroy it. He was just lucky that the ice was starting to melt.

So as I let the film sit with me a few days (after watching it in theaters) it felt like Curtis’ pursuit was not the right one. Neither was Gilliams or Wilford’s so a third way needed to be introduced which was to destroy that “balance” that Wilford was talking about and let nature take its course.

Here is why I can’t agree with you:

Not to bring science into this, but two people cannot recreate humanity. You need 500 or so, or genetic disasters await.

He is not destroying the train, he was destroying all of humanity by destroying their home. Everyone dies after Curtis’s actions. Lucky the ice was melting? Seems like not enough to me. Those kids are doomed. (I know it’s symbolic; they’ll live. But why not have Curtis die and 500 people live?)

Also, some situations just suck. Just because he wants out of the train, doesn’t mean getting off the train is a good idea. Or possible.

Which is why a third way – I get they want one – might not exist.

There’s nothing definitive regarding the survival of the other people on the train. Ironically, the way the derailment is depicted, it seems the front cars fared much better than the rear ones.

There may also be people still alive elsewhere, who didn’t get on the crazy train and found another way. There’s nothing in the movie to indicate this, of course, but being on a train, the characters’ view of the world is limited.

Anyway, I imagine the next scene after the movie is the polar bear mauling Yona and Timmy. Bears gotta eat, too.