Why are the IC (and/or RS) problem definition not in the above issue quad in ToyStory and the Fugitive

questions
#1

Hi,

I’m trying to get the concepts of dramatica.
It uses a lot quads, which I thought I get, but apparently not

The 64-elements-picture can be found on (amongst others) in https://narrativefirst.com/articles/the-essential-ingredients-of-every-complete-story

I am trying to understand the problem definition and followed the movies ToyStory and TheFugitive (see also “http://dramatica.com/analysis/toy-story” and “http://dramatica.com/analysis/the-fugitive”)

I read that ToyStory the IC and the RS problem is not in the issue quad but in a different one

In short the problems are if you would use NAME: THROUGLINE:CONCERN:ISSUE:PROBLEM:

NAME          : THROUGLINE                 :CONCERN:ISSUE:PROBLEM
TOY STORY     : OS: Situation              :How things are changing/Progress:Threat:Determination
WOODY         : MC: Activity               :Doing:Experience:Determination
BUZZ LIGHTYEAR: IC: Manipulation/Psychology:PlayingARole/Being:Desire:Unending(which is not in Desire issue quad but in Thought issue quad)
WOODY VS BUZZ : RS: Mind/FixedAttitude     :ImpulsiveResponses/Preconscious:Worry:Test(wich is not in Worry issue quad but in Confidence issue quad)

And in The Fugitive

NAME            : THROUGLINE                 :CONCERN:ISSUE:PROBLEM
THE FUGITIVE    : OS: Situation              :Future:Preconception:Help
DR KIMBLE       : MC: Activity               :Obtaining:Self-Interest:Pursuit
SAM GERARD      : IC: Manipulation/Psychology:ChangingOnesNature/Becoming:Commitment:help(which is not in Commitment issue quad but in Obligation issue quad)
KIMBLE VS GERARD: RS: Mind/FixedAttitude     :Subconcious/InnermostDesire:Denial:Logic (which is not in Denial issue quad but in Hope issue quad)

Why is this?
Or is this the magic from the Dramatica model?
Or should you use the 64-elements-picture only for MC and OS througlines?

#2

The Relationship Issue is in the same relative position as the Objective Issue, no matter where the problem is.
The Influence Issue is in the same relative position as the Main Character Issue, no matter where the problem is.

So, if OS Issue is top left, the RS Issue is also top left.
If MC Issue is bottom left, IC Issue is also bottom left.
etc

3 Likes
#3

What you’re seeing is Dramatica’s model of subjectivity. In short, we don’t see what really is, but rather, what we perceive.

#4

It’s the distortion effect you see from multiple simultaneous perspectives. For example, if a stick is half-in and half-out of the water, it may appear straight from some angles and bent from others.

The nature of a story is that the perspectives are out of balance and the process of comparing the perspectives allows you to determine which is more accurate, much as you’d use multiple perspectives to determine if it is a straight stick that is bent due to the water refraction, or it is a bent stick that is straightened by the water’s refraction.

1 Like
#5

Thanks for all the replies. It makes it a bit more clear.
Although I don’t understand why it is then as it is, I will follow one of Jim’s podcast advices that you shouldn’t focus on how the magic of Dramatica works, but use the magic.