How do handle a killed IC in the 3rd/4rd act

I am working on a story where my IC is killed in the middle of the story. The IC has a big impact on the MC for the rest of the story … but I am struggling to figure out how and from which perspective the remaining signposts for the IC througline should be illustrated?

Are there discussions going on with OS and MC chars who arguing from the IC perspective? Or should there be some scenes who focus on the issues?

The domain and issue for my IC is Fixed Attitude > Impulsive Responses > Value.

You could have the IC’s death itself, and its aftermath, impact the MC. Along with the IC story points you mentioned, also consider the relevant IC Signpost for the area of the IC’s impact.

Later on, you could have the MC recall the IC and be impacted by those recollections.

(The 4th IC Signpost doesn’t happen to be Memories does it? :slight_smile: )

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Star Wars is a good example of this. The signpost illustrations for the storyform included with the program might be useful.

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Other movies that might help:
Michael Clayton
Unforgiven
Harold & Maude
The Big Chill (extreme case!)

To a lesser extent:
ET (sorta: doesn’t die, but is out of the story for a long stretch)
Sicario (one of them says “see ya” to other late in the story)
Shawshank (similar separation)
Young Frankenstein (the reverse since ain’t no monster early on: from dead to alive)

Yes, its Memories, sometimes dramatica surprises you how accurate it is … but in the next minute I realize dramatica knows more than I do about my own story

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thanks Harold for the list, have red Shawshank some months ago, will check it again. ET is also a good example, its made so well that you even don’t realize in the first place that “someone” important is missing.

Awesome! I LOVE that feeling! (it’s actually Dramatica confirming that your subconscious is making a strong narrative) :wink:

Add PS I Love You as an example. I don’t know the storyform, but what I imagine would have to be the IC dies pretty early on. From there his influence comes from instructions he left prior to his death.

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If it’s any encouragement or consolation, I’m doing a single throughline (the MC) for a short story. But I’m pretty sure if I fleshed out the whole thing my IC is dead throughout the whole story and is NOT a ghost.

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I had a conversation with someone about my father-in-law, who died 15 years ago, and how often my wife and I talk about the advice he would give us.

We have no gimmick to make this happen. No journal we look at, no pictures. And it’s not even memories, really. It’s more like a sense of how he is, and his philosophy. Frequently there’s just a nagging feeling that I/we are not thinking something through the right way.

But let’s say something comes up where I need his advice and nothing is coming to me. I just can’t connect to him… and I get super frustrated. I kick the table in frustration, say. For something like Impulsive Responses, that would work. It doesn’t have to be his impulsive responses, it just has to be that his effect on me evokes Impulsive Responses somewhere.

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Don’t know if this is helpful as neither example has anything to do with a dead character, but it occurred to me that in Toy Story 3, Lotso Huggins influences Woody to return to the daycare to save his friends by being a jerk to other toys. When Woody learns about Lotso, he momentarily abandons his quest to get back to Andy. And in The Jungle Book, Shere Khan influences Mowgli to return to the wolf pack by killing the pack leader and knowing that word will spread to Mowgli.

The relevance from these examples, i think, is that if those are examples of influence, neither influence character is there to directly influence the MC. Maybe the IC can do something or put some bit of information into the story that doesn’t make it back to the MC until after the IC is killed.

thats a very good illustration for the impulsive responses especially connecting this to somebody who is not around but is missed for the on or the other reason. I think I now see how I can move on with my IC getting him involved without having him around anymore.

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Sorry if I’m replying late

  1. The IC isn’t a character it’s a perspective. You could have the IC made up of multiple characters as long as they all shared the same perspective. The only limitation I think is that only one character can represent the IC perspective at a time in any given scene. A classic hand-off is in The Matrix where Morpheus and Trinity both share the IC perspective.
  2. The IC doesn’t have to be a person in the direct sense, like others have suggested in can be a memory, a monster (I believe the shark is the IC in Jaws), society in general, a location - anything that can influence the MC to suggest changing his perspective
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I just saw another potential for an “IC who isn’t there” example:
Emmet Otter’s Jug Band Christmas

Alice & Emmet are co-MC’s. They have the same perspective and even separately do the same things at the same time. The “passed away before the movie” dad of Emmet / husband of Alice is the IC. Both Alice & Emmet reference things that the dad said & did throughout the story and these references influence them to change and take a chance on their dreams.